STEVEN SLATE: Building an audio empire, the hardware vs. software debate, and creating iconic plugins

Speaker 1 (00:00:00):

Welcome to the Unstoppable Recording Machine Podcast, brought to you by Creative Live, the world's best online classroom for creative professionals with glasses on songwriting, engineering, mixing and mastering. The Unstoppable Recording Machine Podcast is also brought to you by Sound Toys and audio effects developer dedicated to bringing color, character, and creativity to the world of digital audio. And now your host, Joey Sturgis, Joel Wanasek and Eyal Levi.

Speaker 3 (00:00:26):

Hey, what's up? Welcome to another episode of Joey Sturgis Forum podcast. Today we have a very awesome dude, Mr. Steven Slate.

(00:00:34):

Yeah, I'm stoked about that, man. He's been helping me make audio better for I don't know how long at this point,

Speaker 2 (00:00:43):

I don't know if I would have a career without Steven Slate.

Speaker 4 (00:00:46):

Didn't you make some of Steven Slate's, drums famous Joey, like kick 10?

Speaker 2 (00:00:51):

I definitely, when I started using them, I think people started taking notice. I mean, obviously he had other stuff going on with other mixing engineers in different genres of music, like active radio rock and stuff like that. But I was the first guy that was looking for something other than superior drummer to make my shitty recording situation work better for me. And that's what I found.

Speaker 4 (00:01:16):

Well, bottom line, what Steven is doing is absolutely awesome and Steven's the shit.

Speaker 3 (00:01:21):

Well, yeah, and I got to say he's done so much that even if you didn't use Steven Slate drums, there's still an opportunity for him to revolutionize your audio life. Because I personally don't have Stevens Slate drums, but I've been using Trigger for ages as well as ever since he started with his emulations and all that. I've been getting those and using those and I love him. I kind of feel like his influence is pretty widespread at this point. Yeah,

Speaker 2 (00:01:51):

Absolutely. I mean, what hasn't he conquered? He's conquered drum samples. He's conquered software. He is conquered hardware. I mean, I don't really know what's next. Maybe he makes a car or something.

Speaker 3 (00:02:01):

Yeah, let's ask him.

Speaker 2 (00:02:02):

We'll have to find out.

Speaker 3 (00:02:03):

Perfect segue. Alright, I'm going to bring him in.

Speaker 2 (00:02:06):

Hey Steven, how are you doing? I'm doing great. It's great to have you on here, man. We were just actually talking about you a little bit. Of course. We were saying all negative things.

Speaker 5 (00:02:14):

Of course. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:02:15):

They're all true.

Speaker 5 (00:02:16):

Nothing I'm not used to at this point in my career. So

Speaker 2 (00:02:20):

Negative away. Well, we were introducing you to the audience. You probably don't really need much of an introduction, but it led me to asking the question, what haven't you conquered? I mean, you've conquered drum samples, you've conquered software, you've conquered hardware. What's next?

Speaker 3 (00:02:34):

Yeah, I mean, are you going to pull a Sweetwater and start doing helicopters?

Speaker 4 (00:02:39):

Now we're talking. I need that.

Speaker 3 (00:02:40):

I was actually

Speaker 5 (00:02:41):

Thinking

Speaker 3 (00:02:41):

More along the lines

Speaker 5 (00:02:42):

Of my own barbecue sauce line or something.

Speaker 4 (00:02:44):

Alright, high five on that. Yeah,

Speaker 5 (00:02:46):

Something out of technology and out of music. I love music, I love technology, but obviously I've been heavily invested in that. But I'm looking for things to be passionate about that have nothing to do with tech or music. And I think barbecue and barbecue sauce is the route I'm going. The

Speaker 3 (00:03:01):

Slate Grill.

Speaker 5 (00:03:02):

The Slate Grill.

Speaker 3 (00:03:03):

Yeah, man. The Slate Grill.

Speaker 5 (00:03:05):

Why not a bad idea slate. Maybe I can create some kind of new smoker of some sort. I don't know. I love that stuff to be honest with you. So I don't be surprised if you actually do see me doing something in that arena.

Speaker 2 (00:03:18):

Slate sauce. I follow you on Instagram and I look at all your food pictures, your bacon and your big barbecues that you have. It's really awesome.

Speaker 3 (00:03:30):

I think that it's actually, we're laughing about it, but it's actually a serious question. Do you think that the same thing that drove you to just go from samples to software to hardware to just keep expanding, expanding, expanding, might actually go outside of music or do you see it staying in music till the end of time?

Speaker 5 (00:03:49):

I'm always going to want to do something in music. I love music. I really, really love music. I have from when I was a kid, having said that a few years ago, I said to myself, I've got to figure out some kind of vice that's unmusical related. It was almost unhealthy to only have one thing that you're into. We live in this amazing universe and there's so much to explore. So somehow I've got myself into actually barbecuing and meat and I take it very seriously. But guys, what's really funny about the whole barbecue thing is it's a lot like audio. For instance, you go on and there's a gear sluts of barbecuing. There's a barbecue forum and there's barbecue,

Speaker 4 (00:04:28):

Sluts,

Speaker 5 (00:04:29):

Barbecue. And for instance, just like the audio forms, you've got the pros who are analog and have their old pit smokers that burn wood. And you've got the new guys with the digital smokers that are convection based and electric smokers, and you have a war between the guys with the old smokers, the analog smokers and the digital smokers. And you have guys who just like some people have secret mixing techniques, guys have their secret rubs and sauces and their secret barbecuing techniques. So as much as I wanted to have this unique new vice, I basically found an industry that is just like the audio industry.

Speaker 2 (00:05:03):

I'm actually really excited that you're passionate about food because I recently discovered that as well. And I think it has a lot of similarities to being a good mixer and knowing the right amount of ingredients to put into your food to make it an explosion similar to how you have to do it in audio production as well. High

Speaker 4 (00:05:19):

Five on that.

Speaker 5 (00:05:19):

Yeah, Joe, there's so many parallels and of course you're still being a creative person, you're creating something, you're mixing, you're creating a piece of music when you're cooking, you're creating a piece of food. It's equally as enjoyable. And yeah, I absolutely love it. I've gotten so passionate. In fact, yesterday alone I was trying some new techniques. I tried what's called the reverse sear and I cooked about three or four different pieces of meat and tried different rubs and all kinds of stuff. And it's a lot of fun. And the best part about it's when you're done, you get to eat. That's a great thing.

Speaker 3 (00:05:51):

So let me ask you something. If you're saying that you're taking on new things and you always want to keep going and expanding your mind and you think it's unhealthy to just be only in music, for instance, was there a time that you were a hundred percent music, nothing else? No hobbies, balls of the walls.

Speaker 5 (00:06:08):

You know what? A lot of the time when I was creating this late brand and companies throughout my late twenties, it really was dedicated to just that. And that's the way you have to launch something. You have to put a lot into it. And it probably wasn't exactly the healthiest way to do it. I'm not going to complain. It's worked out and I'm really happy with how the audio companies are doing. But I mean there were times where I was working 12 to 15 hours a day just getting in the studio early in the morning, leaving when the pitch black in the middle of the night. And I had to work a lot to get this where I wanted it to be. So yeah, I mean for a while I was all about getting the music and the tech company going. Luckily, now I've got a great team and we've got a more established brand and it allowed me to branch out and find new hobbies like the cooking.

Speaker 3 (00:06:55):

But to get to where you are now, it wouldn't have been possible without those years of relentless dedication obviously.

Speaker 5 (00:07:03):

I think that would be accurate to really get something and to launch something into success, you got to put a lot into it. There's a lot that you really have to put into it, and it's a lot of work and a lot of dedication and it takes a lot of passion.

Speaker 2 (00:07:18):

If you don't mind, can we jump into your story a little bit? I was reading your Forbes article and it says that you came to LA in 2005 and you would sneak into Grammy parties and give CDRs of your drum samples to well-regarded audio engineers. I'm just curious, can you reveal what was your mindset behind doing that? Kind of walk through your story a little bit.

Speaker 5 (00:07:41):

So I mean, it really begins in Boston when I was, I had a little underground rock studio and I was recorded a lot of great bands and I was actually stealing some of the bigger bands in Boston from some of the bigger studios, even though I had this hole in the wall warehouse recording studio with a bunch of just gear and a bunch of racks and it was pretty janky. But was that because of your sound? Yeah, I would think so. I mean also just because I was in a band myself, so I'd know a lot of these guys. I would entice them to come to my place, listen to what I could do, and basically my offer was, I can give you the same rock and roll sound. You are going to pay less money and it's going to be a good hang. And people went for it.

(00:08:17):

And I had one or two successful bands over there, and then it was a kind of small family of rock bands over in Boston. So I was able to record a bunch and I was always booked. I was never not working. I was recording mixing every single day anyway, I became pretty into the whole idea of becoming a professional producer, a mixer. I wanted to be a Joey Sturgis. When I got to la, my goal was, okay, well, I learned about a lot of successful producers, mixers, engineers, and they were all proteges of another famous engineer. And they came up in the industry by first starting out as protege and then becoming a successful engineer producer themselves. So I said, okay, that's what I'll do. So I said, okay, well what's my way in? How do I separate myself from all these other guys who are going to want to be proteges of these famous guys?

(00:09:09):

What can I do to separate myself? And the idea I had was drum samples. I'd already made a whole bunch of drum samples. They sounded pretty cool. And I kind of had this notion that a lot of mixed engineers could always use more cool drum sounds to mix into their acoustic drums. So I snuck into quite a few parties and got myself invited to a few parties, but mostly snuck in and I handed out this drum sample CD in hopes that they'd go, okay, well this guy seems like he's a really motivated young chap and he'd be the perfect guy to run my pro tools rig. I mean, that was the idea. It just never came to fruition because what ended up happening is they didn't want me to be their protege. They just wanted more drum sets. So I remember getting calls from some of these guys thinking, oh, here we go. They're going to say, Hey, can you come in and help me? My assistant's leaving, so I need a new assistant. But it just never happened. I get a call and be like Mike Shipley saying, Hey, I'm doing this new Santana record. I need a super cracky snare drum. Can you make me one? I go, yeah,

Speaker 3 (00:10:04):

Sure. That's a really, really great point that I just want to echo because I'm always telling people this. You can never predict where your success into a creative field is going to come from. You just have to have the winning attitude and commitment that you're going to go for it. But when something starts to work, it may not be what you thought it was going to be, but you got to roll with it.

Speaker 4 (00:10:26):

You got to embrace it. Absolutely.

Speaker 5 (00:10:28):

Yeah. And that's really what I did. I just said, okay, well, I was just so infatuated by the fact that these famous guys who I'd only known on the backs of CD jackets were calling me and needing my help. And I thought that was a really cool thing. And I did get pretty excited about it. And I got over the fact that I wasn't a proje because I was having fun. I started making these drum samples and then you start hearing the drum samples on major records. And it wasn't too long after I was giving these drum samples to the top five guys in la, it wasn't too long before I was listening to the radio and every single rock song that it was on the radio had my samples in it. So I thought that was a really cool thing and it got me pretty stoked on making audio stuff.

Speaker 2 (00:11:11):

So you make all these drum samples, they're getting used like hotcakes. And then also I think somewhere in there you decided to sell 'em to the public as well and turn that into a business on its own. Is that right?

Speaker 5 (00:11:25):

Yeah. Well, that had to happen because like I said, I was listening to all these great rock stations with all my drum samples playing, and yet I could barely afford rent because it turns out when you sell a proc to only five people, you don't make a lot of money

Speaker 3 (00:11:39):

Unless it's a Ferrari. Exactly.

Speaker 4 (00:11:41):

Hey, I remember the day Steven Slate drums first came out. I was probably one of the first 20 people to buy it. I saw that post on gear slots and I'm like, mine.

Speaker 5 (00:11:50):

Yeah, it sold pretty quick. I mean, I had a pretty cool marketing strategy, which was like, Hey, listen to the rock records that you've been buying. Those are my samples. Now you can have them. So it kind of worked out my favor. It was a pretty strong marketing campaign to have upon the launch of a product. These samples had already been proven. They were already being used by the pros. And I remember watching all these forum threads saying, Hey, how'd this mixer get this drum sound? How'd this mixer get this drum sound? And in my mind I thought, well, I know, and soon everyone else will know. So yeah, I came out with the product publicly. I learned how to make an HTML website. I learned how to create a PayPal store. I don't even know these skills now. If you asked me to create a website now I can't do it, but somehow when I was 25, I could do it.

Speaker 3 (00:12:32):

Well, let me ask you, what was the length of time between when you first started sneaking into those parties with one idea and fast forward to when you're released to the public? Was that years?

Speaker 5 (00:12:46):

So it was about a year and a half later when I was able to get enough. I think it was just 10 kicks, 10 snares and one set of Toms. That was the first Steven Slate Drums Pro that I went to the public with. And it took maybe a year and a half, maybe because it was late 2006 that came out December of 2006, I think is when it came out. And it sold, I don't know, I think a thousand copies the first month. It was insane. I'd never seen that kind of sales before.

Speaker 2 (00:13:11):

So you do this drum sample thing and you can take it as far as that can go, but then you decide that's just not enough. And I definitely share that with you. You were saying how you had to learn how to do HTML, you had to learn how to make a website, how to make a web store that's very similar to kind of how the three of us operate as well is like we want to figure out how to do something. Okay, I don't know anything about video. So go to the store, buy a camera, start shooting video, figure it out. That's like a core ingredient to our DNA that makes us able to do these kind of things and make us be successful creative people. Now, you weren't getting enough from the drum samples, and so you decided to jump into software next. Is that right?

Speaker 5 (00:13:52):

Yeah, well, I started just liking the fact of making product and before I jumped into more stuff, I evolved the drum software a bit and I started working with third party companies. If you guys remember, I initially started working with Drumma Go. I added more samples. I remember we went to this warehouse in Van Nuys and recorded a whole nother set of samples, and I guess it was called Stevens Slate Drums 2.0 or 2.5, I can't remember. And that actually was when we recorded samples that I know Joey, you were a fan of, it was a snare 12 A and kick 10. Kick 10 snare 12. Yeah, kick 10 snare 12 A, which at the time I didn't realize were going to go down in history as some of the most used samples ever. I still hear if you go to Nashville, actually snare 12 a, I swear there was a time where they just took snare 12 A and just replaced everything.

(00:14:40):

I mean, you'd hear three songs in a row and they'd have the exact same snare drum, just shamelessly mixing it in 90%. It was pretty crazy. But yeah, so that evolved for a bit. And then I started, actually the first thing I did before even software is I started working in hardware and started trying to build my own gear. This is a time 2007, 2008 when gear was still pretty popular nowadays, gear is really getting overshadowed by some of these great plugins, but I've always loved gear. So I started talking to these two guys who made gear, Tim Caswell and Greg St. Regis, and we started designing what ended up becoming the dragon. I got that around. Yeah, there you go. So that's a piece that's still I think is awesome. And at some point I want to model it, but it has just so much stuff to it that I'm like, my God, that sounds like quite a task to do.

(00:15:35):

But then at some point I met Fabrice Gabriel and we both complained about the same problem that was going on in the industry. So remember we're about 2007, eight, somewhere around there. And it was the time where records were getting smashed in the mastering stage. There was just this horrible trend of living in the hell out of records and taking all the punch and dynamics away. It's much to a lesser extent now, especially with stuff like YouTube and iTunes having these limits. But at the time it was like how loud and smashed and horrible can I make this record sound? And I hated it. Fabrice hated it. I especially hated it because all these drum samples I was making with all this nice clarity and punch and transient were getting smashed. You couldn't even hear any of the articulations of my snare transients, which was offensive to me.

(00:16:26):

And Fabrice thought the same thing. And we at the time had both already been experimenting with clipping and every record I was making at the time, I was just using an a d converted a clip. And that was pretty much what every mastering engineer the pro guys were really doing because limiting and peak limiting was just so terrible that day we decided to partner up and say, Hey, let's make an awesome clipper that's not just a clipper, but an optimized clipper. And of course, that became FGX our first slate digital product. And it was a really cool thing because it wasn't just a clipper, it was a clipper that had different attitudes depending on what it was clipping. And it was a really cool concept. And hell, I just mastered a record of a friend's record the other day, and man FGX killed everything on it. It just kept all the clarity of the transient. And it's still a great processor all these years later, seven years later,

Speaker 3 (00:17:14):

I still use it. Yeah,

Speaker 5 (00:17:14):

We love it. And then the 2.0 version we've been working on is going to take it to the next level. So we're really excited about that. But anyway, back to the story. So yeah, I met Fabrice and we came out with FGX, and that's kind of where that all started from. And we started making more products. And at the time I had an analog console and I was trying to think to myself, why the hell is it when I mixed the analog console? Why do I like it better? And I said, it's, there's no magic fairies in this analog console. It's not doing anything magical. What the hell is it doing? And then I said, Fabrice, let's figure out what the hell this analog console is doing and make a plugin that recreates what that's doing. And of course, that became VCC. And then from then on we really got into the whole analog modeling thing. On the other side, I have a company Yellow Matter Entertainment, who originally did all the drum sample stuff, and that's where I met up some guys we made Trigger. And then I ended up going off and making this crazy touchscreen console. And I guess the point is, when you catch that bug of creation, at least for a guy like me, I just consistently and constantly take on new challenges and it just keeps me going, keeps me refueled.

Speaker 3 (00:18:15):

Do you find that if you slow down at all, you start to get depressed or anxious or anything like that?

Speaker 5 (00:18:21):

I think it's not depressed or anxious. I think the word is bored. That's

Speaker 3 (00:18:23):

A good word.

Speaker 2 (00:18:24):

Totally.

Speaker 5 (00:18:25):

Yeah. Well,

Speaker 2 (00:18:25):

First of all, let me ask you, when you met Fabrice, did you have any clue that he was going to be one of basically the leaders in analog modeling for digital platforms?

Speaker 5 (00:18:35):

I did, and the reason I did is because his original a EQ was by far the best thing that I've ever heard in terms of an EQ that just sounded like it was supposed to sound like it didn't have this weird digital thing to it. And I just knew there was something about this guy where he knew how to code. And then when he made that first, the original prototype of the FGX, and I listened to that and I was like, man, he just gets it. So at the time I knew there was something special about him. And then when we did the VCC and he started to learn about analog and nonlinearities and he caught onto it so quick and became so passionate about it and we had these great conversations about what the circuits were doing and all these dynamic nonlinear artifacts, he just got it and we connected so well on it. And I knew that there was just something special about it, and I'm not a very superstitious guy, but there was something about that me and him meeting that was very special.

Speaker 2 (00:19:34):

Let's talk about your qualities a little bit because you have a pretty sizable empire on your hands, and so that definitely takes a special type of person to be able to deal with people and run a company and have employees and stuff. And I know one of the great qualities is that you have a really good sense of humor. I remember the April Fools thing where you were talking about putting out a fart pack.

Speaker 5 (00:19:58):

Sure. It's still in the making. We're still working on it.

Speaker 3 (00:20:03):

Personally, I think having a great sense of humor is key to doing anything in life because the moment you start going somewhere, you're going to get inundated with hate, and if you don't have a sense of humor, it's going to be rough.

Speaker 4 (00:20:16):

I think that's a good topic to talk about too. So Steven, as anybody who's successful knows, the more you succeed, the more hate you get. So how do you like to deal with all of the negative side of doing all the awesome things that you've done where you get those people that for whatever reason, they're pissed off at the world and they decide to lash out at you for no reason.

Speaker 5 (00:20:34):

What you have to realize, and it takes some time to realize this guys, is that it kind of just comes with the territory. If you become a person who is known for whatever reason, and even in this small, tiny little hole in the wall, boutique little audio industry, if you have some kind of impact, you're bound to be polarizing and it's just something you can't escape. It really just happens because there's so many different kinds of personalities and people in the world and you can't expect to win everyone over. You just can't. I have a very specific type of personality. I'm passionate, I'm aggressive. I absolutely think that my stuff is awesome and I'm not afraid to translate that to the world. And sometimes that can be a bit aggressive to some people and it can be a little bit unnerving to some people, and some people don't like it, some people do.

(00:21:21):

But overall, you just have to stay true to yourself, understand where people are coming from. There's a lot of people who have been angry and once you say, okay, you know what? This person's angry because maybe they're having problems with one of my products and they're not feeling they're getting the proper support. So sometimes you have to accept that sometimes the negativity is something that I'm doing that I could fix that can help. Maybe I need to be more communicative. Maybe these people are upset because they bought a plugin and now they can't use it in their new DAW, and you have to put yourself inside their shoes and realize where they're coming from. They bought this plugin, now they want to use Pro Tools 11. We didn't have an a X version for VCC and FGX for a while, and we had a lot of pissed off people and there were a lot of negative people, but I said to myself, I have to understand where they're coming from. At one point I was a customer and I was angry at companies for not doing this and not doing that. So you really have to have a good understanding of people and psychology and understand that you just have to try your best to be the best person you can be, to be the best company you can be and to make the best products you can. And if you do that, you're going to please a lot of people. But the one thing you have to realize is you cannot please everyone.

Speaker 3 (00:22:33):

I think it's interesting in saying in dealing with a lot of the negativity, you're saying understand your market, understand your customers. Some of their complaints may be completely legitimate, and isn't that the same attitude you have to take when creating products that are solutions for problems that they haven't even thought of? That takes understanding your market in exactly the same way? In my opinion,

Speaker 5 (00:22:57):

No, I totally agree. I mean, one product we make that is such a great product, but it's difficult to get people to understand is the Batch Commander, which is basically this really awesome sophisticated macro system that allows you to work.

Speaker 3 (00:23:11):

That's great.

Speaker 5 (00:23:11):

Yeah, thank you. And just, I can't live without it, but some people who just don't get it, they don't understand. They're like, why do I need that? And I'm saying, I dunno, maybe you're not working. A lot of pros are, but sometimes you don't want to sit there and wait around for 60 tracks to balance and manually name them and this does it for you. So it's like one of those challenges that this is not a sexy product. It's not like a compressor or a tape machine plugin or something really sexy and cool, but it's a utility product and what it does in the time it saves to me is the sexiest thing of all. So it's hard that to get that to translate to some people, and these are some challenges, but it makes me work harder to figure out how can I let people understand why they need this? And it's different than when we come out with, for instance, virtual mix rack, which just sells itself. There's really not much I need to do that. That thing just sells like crazy. But Batch Commander on the other hand, I've got to explain to people what this thing can do for you.

Speaker 3 (00:24:06):

It's funny, I feel like a product like Batch Commander will get people the kinds of results necessary so that they can free their mind to be creative enough to use a product like Virtual Mix Rack, because the less bullshit you have to deal with, the less repetitive bullshit you have to deal with when dealing with A DAW, the more time you have to be creative. So I dunno, I think it's a great product. I back it all the way. I wish more people understood it. I think it would make their lives way, way better. Thanks,

Speaker 5 (00:24:38):

Man. Yeah, we're working hard to market it more in a way where people kind of understand, oh, I get it. That's something I really need. And we're going to support more DAW formats. Right now it's just for Logic and Pro Tools on Mac and eventually it'll be for pc, it'll be for all the other DW Studio one, cubase New Endo able to. So hopefully I think I, it's going to really catch on. It does obviously really well with the pro industry, the guys who are working 10 hour days and need this thing. But what I like to see is some more of the hobbyist and home studio guys get something like this application so it can show them what workflow and efficiency is to this kind of art.

Speaker 3 (00:25:19):

Well, one thing that Joey and I do is we give these recording bootcamps where we get a bunch of up and coming producers who want to get better in a room and teach 'em for like 40 hours, four days straight on how it's done. And one of the things that we just slam into their skulls over and over is efficiency, efficiency, efficiency. Anything that you find yourself doing over and over, like naming tracks on one session, then naming tracks again this next time you do drum session naming tracks, again, ad nauseum that takes hours, months off of your life if you actually do the math over the period of a year, all those mechanical tasks will literally take months off of your life that you could have spent walking your dog, cooking, food, mixing, whatever,

Speaker 5 (00:26:08):

Or just working with the artist actually. Exactly, tune and being a producer. It's funny you say that because Paul Wolf, who's a very analytical and mathematical guy, when he looked at Batch Commander and he started doing some math equation and what he realized is if you use Batch Commander on Pro Tools in a year, you can save about two months of time. Thank

Speaker 3 (00:26:29):

You. Thank you.

Speaker 5 (00:26:29):

There it is.

Speaker 3 (00:26:30):

That's exactly what I was saying. Thank you.

Speaker 5 (00:26:33):

He has an equation for it. He said, you can knock off two months of your working time by using Batch Commander, by he calculated per week how much Batch Commander has taken off and multiplied it and came to about two months worth of work. That's really cool.

Speaker 3 (00:26:49):

I am vindicated because I was always telling people that I calculated it to be about one month of my year before I started using batch commands. I calculate about one month out of my year was spent on bullshit with Pro Tools. That's great.

Speaker 4 (00:27:06):

Think about how much extra money you can make as a working pro with an extra month or two months a year. It's insane.

Speaker 5 (00:27:11):

Oh yeah. Especially now, because I see a lot of people where it's not by the hour anymore, it's by the project. So it's like you're getting paid by project by project basis. I see that a lot, at least around LA where it used to be just book studio time and it was an hourly thing, but now it's by the project. The producer usually has his own spot and it's like, okay, for this album it's going to cost this much. So it's in the best interest of the producer to get stuff done efficiently so they can move on and go to the next band. But that's where Batch Commander is really helpful. And it's just weird when I was over someone's place and I had to do a little pro tools editing and I didn't have Batch Commander on that machine, and I was like, my God, this is just so slow, I can't deal with it. So I had went to my account and had to download it and got my eye lock and was back in action soon. But man, I felt like I was a caveman trying to just do everything manually and it was just, it's insane. Once you get used to Batch Commander, it really becomes addictive.

Speaker 4 (00:28:06):

Well, let me back that point real quick, because this month right now, I'll have mixed by the end of the month over 65 songs. And the only way I can do that and perform at the level that I'm performing at is to have an awesome assistant and a workflow that's so refined and so quick where I don't have to think about anything technical. I get the song on my computer, I hit play and I start writing automation and having your system refined to that level. I mean, it's just a money machine. Now,

Speaker 2 (00:28:31):

Steven, you were originally a Cubase guy, weren't you?

Speaker 5 (00:28:34):

Yeah, I mean, I was a Cubase guy when I was back in Boston. I loved using Cubase. I had Pro Tools, a TDM system and a CUBASE system, but I liked using Cubase better, something about it. I dug it. And then nowadays though, I really don't play favorites anymore. I use everything. I actually kind of dig trying to do each project kind of in a new do that sounds crazy and chaotic, but it's also, like I said, I get bored easy. So for instance, I'm about to start doing some stuff in the new studio one version three, which is incredible. I really love the update that Studio One just came out with, and probably after that, maybe I'll switch back to Pro Tools. I'll do something in cubase, I'll do something in Logic. So it's kind of fun and it also keeps my chops up knowing the different daws, which also helps me know the users of those daws. It helps me know, okay, well this user's using logic so I can get the mindset of what the workflow is here, and it helps me make better products for people.

Speaker 3 (00:29:31):

I'm agnostic, man. I think it's the user, not the daw. It doesn't even matter. I think more voices need to be out there saying that which DAW you choose really doesn't make a difference in your final product. What makes a difference is how good you are, how much work you put in.

Speaker 2 (00:29:48):

I'd a hundred percent agree with that. There's so many tools out there now that you could literally make a record. Well, you could make a hundred records and never do it the same way twice. And some of the advice I give to people who feel like they're hitting a brick wall creatively, as I say, shake it up, use different tools. There might be a go-to compressor that you always use on your snare. Don't use it anymore. Try something else. Just see what happens and try to get a good result using different tools. And that ultimately will make you a better producer or engineer or whatever you're trying to do, but try not to rely on any one thing to make your process happen.

Speaker 5 (00:30:24):

It's funny you say that, Joe, because not to constantly keep plugging my products, but with the virtual mix rack, it has this AB system where you can, let's say, put a bunch of processors on a snare. So I'll put the FGS, which models the SSL eq, and then they have a little bit of F gn, which models an EVQ, and I put this chain up and then I'll just say, okay, this sounds good, but now let me just mess around and try something completely different. So then I'll press the B button on VMR, which gives me a clean slate, and then I'll just put some stuff on. I'll crank some stuff. I'll just do just unorthodox stuff that I'm not used to doing, and I'll throw it in the mix and I can AB the chain, the initial chain. That is what the stuff I usually do with this unorthodox method, five out of 10 times, that unorthodox method accidentally ends up sounding better and I'm able to experiment more. And I think that's something that's really cool, and I really love doing that.

Speaker 2 (00:31:15):

Yeah, I think it's a matter of just opening your mind to the fact that you can use tools in different ways, even in ways that they aren't intended to get interesting results. And I think it's the same thing that songwriters do. They might even stay within a certain formula, but sometimes they experiment and that's what creates music that we

Speaker 3 (00:31:36):

All love. Just to loop back on what we were talking about before, if you have a program like Batch Commander or just a super efficient system, you can have the time to experiment like that and take your sound to new places. This efficiency thing is part of what allows a modern day producer to become creative because it's super easy, especially when you're doing a lot of projects to stick to the same tools that work every single time.

Speaker 5 (00:32:04):

I think the unfortunate situation is a lot of newcomers, they go for the sexy stuff. What's sexy name? Oh, the coolest, newest plugins or microphones or the newest interfaces. And they don't quite understand the importance of workflow and efficiency. And I think that it takes some time to realize that that is one of the key elements. For instance, I talked to a lot of schools and give seminars at schools, and I'll talk to students afterwards and they'll say, oh yeah, I'm saving up to get this really awesome new or this new awesome mic. And I'll say, well, what's going on with your computer? What kind of computer? Oh, I've got this really crappy old Mac. I'm like, no, no, no. See, you got it all wrong. You're trying to buy a new microphone when you really need to update your OS and have a faster OS and with a better CPU processor so that you can use all this plugins and use all this stuff and get lower latency recording and stuff like that. So there's kind of this issue with a lot of guys in the industry and not really putting their priorities, at least what I think are proper.

Speaker 3 (00:33:10):

We see the exact same thing with mixing techniques with people trying to do stuff like MS processing and parallel compression and all that before they even know how to use a four band eq.

Speaker 4 (00:33:21):

Yeah. The bottom line is fundamentals aren't sexy. People glaze over them because they're like, oh, well, that's boring Shit. Want the most advanced, most exciting thing because it's the sex appeal of it. You feel better about yourself. It's like a ego driven thing.

Speaker 5 (00:33:33):

Yeah. Well, I always say this is a male dominate industry, and if there's one thing males like it's to show off how they're their sexy stuff. One of the biggest challenges I had as a plugin manufacturer trying to convince guys with hardware that they should use this plugin was like, okay, here you are. You have all this cool sexy gear in a rack, and I'm trying to convince them to replace all that stuff that's in their rack with this bunch of cartoons on a computer, and that's my job. And as males we're like, no, look at my sexy hardware big gear. It's big. It's got knobs. I can touch it. It's shiny. It's shiny. It's like, look at it's, it's very cave, Manny, because look, step into my studio and see how big everything is. It's like, okay, well now step into my studio and let's all huddle around my laptop.

(00:34:21):

I mean, that's really what the industry's come down to. But the important part is it's not about how sexy my racks of gear are. It's about how sexy the song I just made is. It's about how awesome the art is that we're creating, because that's really what this is about. This is about creating art. I actually just saw this post on Facebook some, I dunno, some sad studio had this picture of all their racks of gear and they're like, real gear is sexy plugins. And my reply was, making music is sexy, debating whether you should do it with hardware, software isn't. Boom.

Speaker 3 (00:34:57):

I have a question about that actually, and I think you've done a really good job of this, but how do you go about convincing people who are stuck in their ways who don't want to see the light about plugins? How do you convince them that plugins are cool or that you can get a better result? Sometimes with the plugin,

Speaker 5 (00:35:16):

There's two kinds of people. There are people who genuinely just, they want to make music, they don't have any ego into it, and they just want to make music. And those guys, for instance, there's a guy online on gear slips right now who bought the VMR and he noticed that RFG one 16 sounded exactly like his vintage 1176 s, and he posted abs and he's convinced, he's like, man, this is better. He's like, I love my 1176 s, but this sounds exactly the same, and I can have a gazillion of these throughout my session. He just cared more about what's going to make him the best music. He's a successful guy. He's done a bunch of big records. Then there's the guys who just are threatened by this change in industry and they just don't care. They don't want to hear that this sounds the same.

(00:36:01):

And I understand it too. I mean, some of these guys have spent their whole lifetimes saving up money, working hard. They buy this gear, it's special to 'em. There's a romanticism. There's a nostalgia to this gear, and they just get really threatened and upset that this little cheap software plugin can do what their hard earned hardware is doing. And for those guys, it's a hopeless matter. They're just not going to listen. They're not going to care. I can post as many blind abs as possible. I can even have them, Hey, listen, what do you think? Which one's the hardware? Which one's the software? I'll post a bunch of blind abs and boom, they go away faster than you can ever imagine. They don't want to accept it, and that's fine. I can understand it if they don't want to accept it. We we're going to go through a lot of that with our new microphone product, the virtual microphone system's about to come out.

(00:36:52):

And I can tell you, I'm sitting next to my workstation right before this call, we were listening to the abs of the real U 40 sevens and Telefon two 50 ones versus the models. It is so indistinguishable that it's ridiculous, but there are some guys out there, some small medium studios who spent years saving up to buy these vintage mics, and they're just not going to want to accept the fact that you're going to be able to replicate this sound. They're going to want to think to themselves, no, there's a magic sound in these expensive mics that will never be replicated, and they're going to be very threatened and defiant and maybe even aggressive towards the VMS product. But you know what? I can't let that stop me because there's so many guys who were like me back in Boston in my twenties, who just wanted that sound of these mics so bad, but could never, ever afford it.

(00:37:36):

And now I'm going to give that opportunity to use these different color palettes of microphones to so many engineers who would never have had the opportunity to even sit in a room with these vintage mics. So that's what you have to keep thinking. And it's the same thing with the plugins and the gear. Yeah, I mean, we're always going to have some threatened hardware guys say that, oh, you can't make music with that stuff, but listen, we all know you can. And it's already been done. Some of the biggest, best sounding records I've heard are done with plugins.

Speaker 3 (00:38:03):

It's been done for a while now too. It's

Speaker 5 (00:38:05):

Been done for a while and it really, when it comes down to we all know the truth, it's about the talent of the engineer, the talent of the band, and the greatness of the song. That's what it comes down to. Whether you want to use hardware or software, it just doesn't matter anymore. And to the people it does matter to. That's fine. I can't do anything about it. I've sometimes tried to fight some of these guys and say, Hey, you're saying that plugin sound, phasey and plasticy, okay, well, here's a few files. One uses plugin, one uses hardware, which is which, and they never answer. They always go away or they get it wrong and they have an excuse as to why they got it wrong. Oh, well, oh, I was listening to my laptop. Oh, you did a professional listening test on your laptop. Well, that just shows exactly what we're dealing with. So at the end of the day, hardware, software, I don't care what people use, you can use my plugins, use my competitor's plugins. When it comes down to it, if you're having fun and making great music, that's what this thing's all about. Totally.

Speaker 2 (00:38:59):

The thing I always tell people is the digital age is coming. You can't stop it. It's not going to go away. You might as well embrace it and use it for what it is. They are useful tools. You can't deny it.

Speaker 3 (00:39:10):

When the Kemper profiling Amp came out a few years ago, I bought it, and the guys I worked with back then, we all bought it and we profiled our entire AMP collection. I am talking 25 or six amps, and we took 10 days profiled everything and ended up making profiles of every single record we worked on ever since. And we got a lot of guys who would come in who were tube amp purists who did not want the Kemper involved. Even though we realized while profiling this, sometimes we could make the profiles sound better than the AMP itself. Not always, but sometimes. So we're agnostic. If the tube amp is better for that particular album, cool, we'll do that. If the Kemper's better, we'll do that. But we're not going, it's not a predetermined thing. However, for some guys coming in, it was a predetermined thing. So I would always do the blind ab, which one do you think is the 51 50 this or this? And most times they would get it wrong and they would think that the Kemper that we improved was the real 51 50. And I got to say a lot of guys were actually converted, but it took getting them in the room with us. I don't think we could have converted them online via forum. It took being in the room and actually showing them, look, you're hearing it on our monitors. You couldn't tell the difference, dude,

Speaker 5 (00:40:38):

Come

Speaker 3 (00:40:38):

On, let it go. Yeah,

Speaker 5 (00:40:40):

I've done the same thing with people in the room too. Sometimes it took some of my pro friends who just, these guys have been using analog gear since 30 years, so sometimes it just took them getting in my studio and doing a live AB and getting them convinced. But the same thing happens all the time. Sometimes they just prefer the software even they think the software is the hardware. That's what happened on this online test with this one customer who's comparing his vintage 1170 sixes in two different tests. More people thought the software was the hardware than the other way around. So I mean, when it comes down to it, this is an industry that this hardware's romanticized so much, and I get it. There's a romantic and sexy nature about these big chunks of metal.

Speaker 2 (00:41:19):

I dunno, dude. I think what's sexy is, for me, workflow is sexy, and if I can have 20, 11, 70 sixes without having to actually have a wall that is the temperature of the sun behind me, then that's fucking awesome for me. So I'd rather have the software.

Speaker 5 (00:41:36):

Well, you have a much more logical concept of making music that's a lot more logical. Why would you want a bunch of hardware to constantly patch in and manually recall when you could just have double click a project and it's all there and it sounds awesome. It's a very practical and logical way of thinking about things, and that's why you're such a success. I see a lot of guys who are really successful in this industry doing the same thing. Senia, even Justin Knee Bank does a lot of stuff in the box, and I know a bunch of other big mixers who you're going to be shocked, but this year you're going to see them going in the box. Some guys who you never would've thought are going in the box. I unfortunately can't quite mention who, but

Speaker 4 (00:42:21):

Gear Sluts is going to have to rebrand a plugin sluts.

Speaker 3 (00:42:24):

Exactly. You really just can't fight the future. It's like the guys who think that if everything just went to vinyl, somehow the record industry would be saved or something. It's not going to happen.

Speaker 5 (00:42:37):

Yeah. I mean, there's a giant part of our industry though that is very nostalgic. I remember it was a few years ago, and I went on a forum and I told people that CDs are literally going to be gone within the next few years, and there were so many guys hating on that. I mean, they didn't even want CDs to go, it's a digital thing. They were like, no, no CD cells actually picked up this year. I'm like, no, no. I don't care what little statistic of the internet you found CDs are going bye bye, and you're not even going to be able to buy CDs at stores soon. I mean, I remember at the time I was walking to the Best Buy, I was watching that CD aisle shrink and shrink. I'm like, no, they're going. It's going away. And no one wanted to hear, or at least some guys just did not want to accept that. Can we bring

Speaker 4 (00:43:14):

Back cassette

Speaker 5 (00:43:14):

Tapes though?

Speaker 3 (00:43:15):

Yeah. Yeah. That's great. I mean, I think this is just a human nature issue too.

Speaker 5 (00:43:20):

Sure. Change. Change is scary. It's a scary thing for change.

Speaker 3 (00:43:23):

Exactly. And I mean, look, we see this on bigger world issues as well. I definitely don't want to turn this into a world conversation. Let's keep it to music. But we see it also with the whole climate change issue. No matter what scientists say, no matter what the evidence shows, there are people who will deny what science is telling us. And there are people who will deny all the data on how music sales are changing and what physical formats are going out and everything. They just don't care. They just don't see it. They refuse to see it end of story. I just think it's a human nature thing. But those of us who make a living off of this and who are trying to push music forward into the new age, I think have to keep an open mind and have to keep abreast of all the coming changes.

Speaker 5 (00:44:09):

But what are those thousands and thousands of scientists know about science?

Speaker 3 (00:44:12):

Yeah. I don't know.

Speaker 5 (00:44:15):

I mean, I trust a politician way more than 10,000 scientists. I mean, when it comes to climate, who are you going to trust? Experts on climate and science or a congressman

Speaker 3 (00:44:28):

Who brings a snowball into Congress?

Speaker 5 (00:44:31):

But that's a great comparison. I totally agree with you.

Speaker 3 (00:44:34):

Yeah. It's just people will stick their heads in the sand. The reason I bring a vinyl is because there was a movement, and there still kind of is a movement that thinks that this vinyl resurgence, which is nothing more than just collectors items, marketing, marketing collector's items.

Speaker 5 (00:44:51):

Well, it's a trend. Like anything. It is a trend, and it's a fun trend. I like it. I think it's a cool trend,

Speaker 3 (00:44:56):

But it's not going to save the industry.

Speaker 5 (00:44:58):

No, no, no. It's not going to have anything to do with the industry. I mean, I don't think the industry needs saving. It needs accepting. No,

Speaker 3 (00:45:05):

You're right. You're right. Just

Speaker 5 (00:45:06):

Like the digital thing and audio is not going away. Neither is the subscription type of digital distribution of music today. That's not going to go away, but you have to figure out, okay, how can this be monetized? How can we as a music industry make money? There's still people listening to music. How can we make money? How do we do this? How can we use what is happening right now and figure out some new ideas?

Speaker 3 (00:45:29):

Absolutely. And by record industry, I didn't actually mean music. I meant physical, medium.

Speaker 5 (00:45:34):

Understood. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (00:45:35):

Music will always be here. There will always be people who record it, and there will always be people who consume it, how that happens. Well, that's what we're seeing evolve.

Speaker 4 (00:45:44):

Here's a question for you, Steven. Where do you find a lot of your inspiration? For example, do you like to read a lot? What does Steven Slate do in his free time to get fired up and excited?

Speaker 5 (00:45:54):

That's an interesting question. I mean, I do a lot. I love listening to music. Something I've done in the last year is I set aside sometime a day, whether it's when I'm working out or when I'm just relaxing to listen to music and find new music. There's so much great music out there. I hear people complain, oh, the music industry kind of crap. I'm like, really? Because you must not be listening to the same stuff I am. I find great music every day because there's such an easy way for people to make music. Of course, there's going to be a lot of stuff that's available that's maybe not your taste, but there's also a lot of great stuff that's out there that you can find a lot of indie artists, and I love listening to music and getting new ideas from that. I love speaking to other people in the industry and getting ideas from them.

(00:46:40):

And then I just love just messing around. I mean, I'm still on the whole music topic, but I'm fortunate enough to have a team who can make me lots of fun, cool little DSP process stuff that I can join together and make my own little plugins. In fact, the next plugin coming out for VMR is something that I created from a lot of the algorithm work that we had. And to me, that's a fun thing. I mean, most of it has to do with art and creation really. And of course then there's just a lot of cooking meat.

Speaker 3 (00:47:07):

Do you find that now that you do have a team and that you can delegate tasks and that you can be the visionary who gets involved but also has a personal life? Do you find that you can be even more creative?

Speaker 5 (00:47:20):

Yeah. Yeah. I do. I do. I think it's important to have some time to breathe. I don't regret all the work I put into building the brand and building the company, but I think having time to relax allows my brain to come up with cool stuff. And I think some of my best ideas have happened when I was relaxing on a beach with my mind super calm. So I think, and that's a lesson I've actually learned. At one point, I was like, no, no. Anytime I took a break, I felt guilty. I felt really guilty when I took a break, and now I understand that it's just as important to play and relax as it is to work.

Speaker 2 (00:48:00):

I'm glad you said that, and I have a little rant. I won't make it very long.

Speaker 3 (00:48:05):

Rant away, dude. Get her.

Speaker 2 (00:48:07):

I just want to say, it makes me so angry to work in this industry and make records for creative people and not have the management understand that simple concept that sometimes I need to just disappear for a week and come back and be like, oh, shit. I know exactly what I need to do to this record to make it perfect. It's like if you leave for a day, they're like, whoa, we're going to need a one day refund. You're not working on that day. And it's like, we're not paying you to go take a piss. Yeah. Get the fuck out of here, dude. If you want me to be creative and you want me to basically put all of my emotion into something. I have to be passionate about it, and if I need to get away for a day or a week or whatever, to regain that passion or to maybe realign my vision, then that's what it's going to take. That's part of the process, and I think that should be a part of the industry needs to open up and understand that a little more.

Speaker 3 (00:49:04):

There's psychological physiological, scientific studies that show that creativity is a finite resource of our brain. It's something that needs to be regenerated. It can only be regenerated through downtime, meaning sleep, but not just sleep, mental downtime. It's not something that you can just keep on going. Like if you decide to walk from New York to la, you could do that. All you'd have to do is sleep in between and make sure that you're being getting the proper nutrition. But for creativity, the mind needs time to rest. And this is scientifically proven if the industry that we work in expects the creatives to work at the highest level, the time to refresh that creativity should be part of what's worked into everything, in my opinion.

Speaker 4 (00:49:54):

I was going to say that if managers actually had fucking talent, they'd be producers. But enough said. So I got another great question. We got to find out how hardcore you really are, Steven, when it comes to cooking. So what kind of salt do you use when you cook? This is a serious question. Well,

Speaker 5 (00:50:12):

I'll give you a serious answer. When I cook, the best thing to do for rubs and meats is what's called kosher salt.

Speaker 4 (00:50:19):

Have you ever tried the Himalayan stuff?

Speaker 5 (00:50:21):

I have tried the Himalayan stuff, but I always come back to good old kosher salt because the grain size is really perfect for the flavor of meats and for also just using it and putting it on. When you're grabbing a rub and the way it holds in your hands and your fingers, it's perfect. And it's kind of been a proven thing. Most top chefs and barbecue guys are into the kosher salt. It's great.

Speaker 4 (00:50:42):

I agree. It's got the right perfect texture for salting anything.

Speaker 3 (00:50:45):

My girlfriend's a chef and she backs the kosher salt as well. So what's next? Can you even say what's next?

Speaker 5 (00:50:52):

Well, I mean, one thing that is pretty well known about what's next is the microphone and preamp line. That's going to be really exciting for me because I bought a U 47 in my mid twenties, and I remember saving up for it for just forever. Just

Speaker 3 (00:51:05):

Say, that's not cheap.

Speaker 5 (00:51:06):

No, it was not cheap, and it was a special moment. And actually the first mic I bought was a sound lux U 95 s. That was the first expensive mic I bought, and it was just this awesome, awesome moment. I got it from mercenary audio from Fletcher over in Foxborough, and then I ended up later selling that and buying a vintage U 47, and it was just this magic moment, and luckily I had a decent enough success to be able to afford even that. But now to be able to have an entire Mike locker and let's forget that authentically models the sound of all these famous mics, just to have a microphone that has a tonal palette that's unique that you could put on an artist or put on a source and flip through these different sounds to find the one that just fits right.

(00:51:51):

I think that's going to be a really fun product, and it's going to add to people's creativity. Forget the fact that it's modeling these hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of mics just to find that one mic that fits, that one singer's voice, and to do it in a really cool way and to not have to spend tons of money that's going to be a special product for me. It really comes from the heart and from the recollection of what it's like to be a struggling engineer and to want all these great tools but not be able to afford 'em. So it's going to put this great technology and this great sound palette within people's reach. So that's something that's going to be coming out soon.

Speaker 3 (00:52:23):

Do you remember maybe 10 years ago that one piece of software that tried to do that?

Speaker 5 (00:52:29):

Yeah, it was the Ataris Mike Waller.

Speaker 3 (00:52:31):

Yes. God, I got that didn't work too well. Well,

Speaker 5 (00:52:33):

It's a completely different type of tech. It's so far away from what we're doing.

Speaker 3 (00:52:37):

Yeah, I mean, it's a decade ago.

Speaker 2 (00:52:39):

I think it was just basically an impulse.

Speaker 5 (00:52:42):

That's exactly what it was, Joe. Whereas

Speaker 2 (00:52:43):

Your product is going to be doing the dynamic range, the harmonic distortion, the saturation.

Speaker 5 (00:52:49):

Well, it's a lot more than that, Joe, because what we're doing is we're starting off with a very wide bandwidth, high resolution source. That's the biggest problem that that Antares plugin has. You can't turn something that has less information to something else that has more information.

Speaker 2 (00:53:03):

Yeah, that's pixelated to start with.

Speaker 5 (00:53:05):

You can't turn an SM 57 into E 47 because SM 57 is going to have a lot less information and a lot less bandwidth than U 47, a ton less. So the ML one that we designed is on its own, an incredible, incredible mic. It's so high bandwidth, it's so high resolution, the sensitivity, everything about it. It just captures a lot of information. And from that we can, yeah, like you said, then we add all these very sophisticated dynamic to replicate what the response of the modeled microphone's doing. I mean, one of these small little things back when the mic modeler came out would've taxed an entire CPU. I mean, so it had to happen. Now we needed the CPU power to really support what the algorithm is doing.

Speaker 3 (00:53:51):

So you are starting with a fantastic source and then altering it to fit the characteristics of whatever, Mike, as opposed to, yeah, like you said, starting with whatever random source

Speaker 5 (00:54:02):

And then just doing impulse modeling. Again, you can't capture the sound of a U 47. Even if we did use our mic and our really high resolution mic, we can't just put an impulse on that sound and make it sound like a U 47. You've got dynamic artifacts, you have some little bits of saturation, you have harmonics. I mean, all these things help recreate what that mic sounds like. Again, just like with the consoles, there's no magic farriers in microphones. A microphone is a circuit. It's a circuit that starts with this analog natural source, but ultimately, once that source hits that diaphragm, it's going through a circuit and has a certain sound, has a certain dynamic frequency response, certain phase response, harmonic response, and we can recreate that if we have a wide enough resolution source.

Speaker 3 (00:54:46):

See, I think that right there is a perfect explanation of what it does. I've actually been curious about what it does because my only recollection of a microphone modeler was from 10 years ago, and I remember it sucking. So hearing exactly the thought process behind this, I actually can totally see it working. It makes perfect sense.

Speaker 5 (00:55:07):

I assure you it works and we're going to prove it works that when we launch, we're going to have a live AB with the real mics and have a whole bunch of big time ears come and listen to it from themselves. And it'll be a top down marketing thing where these guys are, they're not getting paid. They're just there to hang and listen.

Speaker 2 (00:55:24):

That's awesome.

Speaker 5 (00:55:25):

I'm pretty sure they're going to give this thing the thumbs up. That's super exciting.

Speaker 2 (00:55:28):

Congrats on everything that you're doing. And just to echo my thoughts, and I think probably our audience thoughts, thank you so much for all the tools that you've created and given creative people to work and do great art.

Speaker 3 (00:55:40):

Yeah, man. Life changing for real.

Speaker 5 (00:55:42):

That's really nice of you guys to say. I mean, I love doing it and it's a gratifying thing to know that people are making great art with some of the stuff that we create. I think

Speaker 4 (00:55:50):

You're a great example, Steven, for kids coming up is an example of that. Yes, hard work, dedication, commitment, and having a set of balls to really go for it. That's the example to follow if you really want to do something in this industry.

Speaker 3 (00:56:03):

Let me ask you one question, if you don't mind. One last question. We asked this to a lot of our business minded guests. If you had one piece of advice for someone coming up in the production industry or the music industry in 2015, someone who is 20 years old or 16 years old, who doesn't even remember the shift from CDs to digital, someone who is of this era completely, what would be your number one piece of advice to them? How to get to the point of making a respectable living and not struggling?

Speaker 5 (00:56:37):

So I'll say two things. The first thing is if you are working in music, you have to do it because you love it. You can't do it with the mindset of thinking that you're going to be a huge gazillionaire or you're going to do U two's. Next record. You have to work in music because there's nothing else you can imagine yourself doing that will make you happy. And going into it with that mindset is automatically going to give you more success. If you go into it with the complete mindset of, oh, I'm going to do this, and then this'll get me money and this'll get money, money is a necessity. I get it. But you can't let your ambitions be clouded by just the entire thought of making money. It really has to come from a point part of your soul that just can't do anything else.

(00:57:26):

And that's one piece of advice. Do it because you love it. Don't think that you have to revolve it around always becoming the biggest next greatest thing. Just do it. You love it. So that's piece of advice, number one, and that always is going to get you more success. The money will come if the passion is there. The passion will drive you to a part of success where you can make a living. And the second piece of advice, I would say is that just like when you're going on a trip, you plan out your voyage, you get a map, you figure out where you're going, you figure out the best route. You have to do the same thing with life and your career. You can't just kind of roll the dice and just figure out, oh, I'll make a left and a right and go around a circle and maybe I'll end up where I want to be.

(00:58:11):

I think it really helps to have an end game, say, this is what I want to do, and then create a logical strategy that is going to guide you to where you want to go. I see too many people who are just too unfocused, and that unfocused is naturally going to not get you to where you want to go because you need to have some type of logical plan. So I think those are my two pieces of advice. Do this because you love it and do it with some type of logical strategy with an end game in mind.

Speaker 3 (00:58:41):

Okay. Let me just say something based on the last one you said, which is actually on both things you said. I just want to echo this. If your goal in life is money, there are other ways to make it way easier where you have a much higher chance of success than music. So if your goal is purely financial, go into economics. But with the other idea of having a plan, I think it's hugely important to have a plan, but just like you said, you wanted to be a huge producer and this whole other thing happened. So I feel like having a plan is super important. For instance, I wanted to be a guitar God in a huge band and all this stuff in a rock band. I got signed to a major label in a death metal band, which was a joke side project, which led to a production career, which led to everything. So I think that you have to have the determination and a plan to follow through with, but then also be flexible enough to roll with the punches and recognize when something might be giving you success.

Speaker 5 (00:59:48):

Sure. I mean, sometimes that plan, like you said, ends up changing to the point where now your end game changes. You're still on a logical step, but this logical step then got you to another place, which changes your end game. But the same kind of thing still prevails where you need to have that logical strategy. So yeah, so I start off wanting to be a big time producer and be the protege, and I had this end game in mind. I said, okay, the weight, my strategy is going to be getting these drum sample CDs to these big producers, which is then lead me to here, will lead me to there. But yeah, like you said, at some point I got on an alternate route. It changed my end game, but I still kept a strategy and a plan.

Speaker 3 (01:00:26):

Yeah, you can't do it without that. I just wanted to clarify that for people who may not see that it's not a black or white thing, you do need to have the determination of the plan as well as the flexibility.

Speaker 5 (01:00:40):

There's one more important point to that is along this journey, this logical plan, as much as you put effort into creating this really practical strategy, you're going to run into obstacles, you're going to get pushed down, and you just got to keep picking yourself back up because the successful person just knows that you got to keep on overcoming all of this negativity, any kind of obstacle, and just doesn't let themselves get defeated. You pick yourself up. You might have to change the root a few times. You might have to rework the plan, but ultimately you just got to keep that end game in mind and keep going.

Speaker 3 (01:01:14):

I think one of the best quotes I've ever heard is that winners let adversity become a part of their history while losers let adversity become their story.

Speaker 4 (01:01:25):

Oh, I like that. I got a simpler version of that. You got to be your own cheerleaders. Absolutely.

Speaker 3 (01:01:31):

It's true. Except I'm not dressing up like one.

Speaker 2 (01:01:35):

Honestly. You're the only person that can stop yourself. So if you don't let that happen, then you will succeed. You will go forward.

Speaker 3 (01:01:41):

Absolutely. And with that, Steven, thank you so much for coming on,

Speaker 5 (01:01:45):

Guys. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. Absolutely. It's been amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:01:49):

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